This morning, I read my American boyfriend some parts of Jeremy Rifkin's book The European Dream. I read the sections pertaining to the American Dream and the religosity of the United States. The extent of religosity and its ties to the American Dream in the United States was made clear to me for the first time in Rifkin's book. ("They [Americans] believe that the American way is God's way" (Rifkin, 2005, p. 19); "Nearly half of all Americans (48 percent), for example, believe that the United States has special protection from God." (Rifkin, 2005, p 19); "Nearly half of the American people say that it is necessary to believe in God to have good values" (Rifkin, 2005, p 19); "Sixty-eight persent of the public believe in the devil." (Rifkin, 2005, p 20); "... 40% percent of the American people believe that the world will end with an Armageddon battle between Jesus and the Antichrist." (Rifkin, 2005, p 20)) It turns out that my American boyfriend recognized every statistic given in the book from his own experience. The section on the American Dream I recognized myself, other than the specificity Rifkin claims for the American Dream ("The first thing to understand about the American Dream is that from the very beginning it was meant to be exclusive to America. It was never meant to be a dream shared with or exported to the rest of the world. Its power rested in its particularism, not in its universalism. One can only pursue the American Dream on American soil." (Rifkin, 2005, p. 17)) and the aspect of being a "chosen people" (Rifkin, 2005, p.18). My boyfriend recognized both of those aspects as well.
Perhaps my lack of understanding of the religosity and the particularism of the American Dream are due to my being a third culture kid. I imagine that one could pursue the American Dream anywhere, just not calling it the American Dream, simply a dream of a more prosperous life. Perhaps the feeling that Americans have that one pursues this dream at home is one I share, it's just that home isn't just the United States for me, and so logically it follows (for me) that if a dream of prosperity is pursued at home, it can be pursued anywhere.
The Americans I know evidently are not representative on this matter. Perhaps that's not surprising, since people that want to befriend me are generally not typical in some way or other of their country in the first place. When it comes to the religosity, I recognize myself thinking as an European, especially perhaps as a Nordic person. ("While six out of ten Americans say that thir religion is 'very' important in their lives, in European countries religion is barely a factor in people's day-to-day lives. (...) Many Europeans no longer believe in God. While 82% of Americans say that God is very important to them, approximately half of all Danes, Norwegians, and Swedes say that God does not matter to them.") I probably have difficulty really understanding the religiosity in the United States in part because my parents are European Christians, who do not mix religion and politics and who have no problems with others having different religious views. I am an atheist, but that doesn't prevent us from having interesting discussions about religion.
My experience with America from my childhood did not include American Christianity to any extent that I remember. Therefore, my third culture logic is as follows: Religion has been responsible for so many of our moments of shame in history, like the Inquisition, and been used as a political tool, like kings confiscating the gold of the Church for fund a war, that we must make amends and make sure we will never repeat the mistakes we have made in the past. (This also applies to the Holocaust, ten times stronger, but that's not the topic here.) This is a modern insight into our own history, along with our realization of the importance of universal human rights. We modern people now know that our ideas of the past were horrible and violated the rights of countless human beings, both inside and outside Europe. That's why we have consicously left religion out of civil society and politics. You can be religious if you wish, but that does not belong anywhere but your own head, in private moments. If you bring religion into politics or anywhere else in public life, you are retracing the path that brought disgrace to our history. Since this is an insight of modernity, and since both Americans and Europeans are modern and Self (to me), Westerners collectively have left religion behind in public life. Unfortunately for me, that's not true. My sense of "we" spans both Europe and America, but the two are in fact different and the "we" I feel is a figment of the third culture.
While I was reading out the statistics on Americans and religosity, I was laughing at some of the statements, like that many Americans believe in the literal existence of the devil. It seems so incredulous to me in part because I was taught by the Catholic Church in Sweden that the devil does not in fact exist, but is rather a literary character used to make a point, and that hell also doesn't exist as a place but is a ltierary metaphor for life without God. Since the Catholic Church is hardly progressive and is supposed to be universal, I never imagined that Christianity in America could be so different. Believing such things is positively medival to me, which strongly conflicts with my feeling that the US is a modern country. My boyfriend said that he was a little hurt by my laughing. His reason was very interesting. He said that although he knew I was right, he felt hurt because he would like it to be true. Expanding on that thought, he took one aspect of the American Dream - the notion that America is destined for greatness by God - and replaced that with the emphasis on the individual and working hard. To replace his wish that God existed and was watching over the US, he chose to believe that the US is and will stay great because of the hard work of its people. He also agreed with Rifkin's - and my - opinion that in some ways the US is stuck in the past when it comes to nationalism. Then again, like I already said, anyone who wants to be my friend - and perhaps especially my boyfriend - is likely to be at least somewhat cosmopolitan.
I do wonder how many Americans feel like my boyfriend. Rifkin asks, "What happens to the American sense of being special, of being a chosen people, in a world where exclusivity is steadily making way to inclusivity? Does God really care less about the whole of his [sic] earthly creation than he does about the North American part? Europeans might find such a conjecture funny, but, believe me, many Americans remain wedded to the notion of our special status as God's chosen ones. If we were to give up that belief, or even entertain doubt about its veracity, our sense of confidence in ourselves and the American Dream might experience irreparable harm." Could others replace the idea of being chosen with the idea of making themselves special through hard work, preserving the core of the American dream in a way more compatible with a global world?
Time will tell.
References: Rifkin, J. (2005) The European Dream.New York, NY: Penguin Group
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6 comments:
Your comments about religion are interesting. I do not know that I would consider myself a religious person, but I am a spiritual person, and I do believe in things that transcend the physical world. I don't know if you took notice of our wedding ceremony, but the script -- which was originally taken from the United Reform Church -- was heavily edited by me. I removed all mention of Christ or Christianity because I'm not Christian and neither is Laura (although she was raised Catholic), and I particularly took out any mention of sacrificial love, but I did leave in God. The editing process was quite informative for me. It became clear to me (for the first time) that Christian text states that our knowledge of God empowers us to love, whereas I have always believed that it is by loving and living a good life that we learn of God. The causal arrow in my beliefs is reversed from what Christians believe.
Recognizing this has actually helped me a lot to understand why I dislike religion in America so much. Statements suggesting that religion should not feature prominently in one's life have always bothered me: logically, one's belief about the moral order of the world should be of great importance! And yet, what I really want most is for religious people shut up about it. I think I am finally starting to understand why. The problem is not that they are living their beliefs; the problem is that they put forth religion or religious text as the motivation for their actions. It suggests that a person needs the religion to live a good life. This seems so backwards to me. I live my beliefs too, but it's by living a good life that I affirm my moral sense of self. I read some about ethics and philosophy, I think about my beliefs, I attempt to exemplify my ideas of what a person should be, and in doing so I strengthen my connection with my spiritual side. Religion is the product of experience, not the drive for it. In practice this means that I don't ever have to discuss religion when discussing politics, ethics, etc. I can find good reasons for my choices in this world, and it's by experience in this world that I might learn something about what lies beyond it.
I realize this was somewhat personal/anecdotal, and not really intellectual, but I hope you appreciate the perspective. It's amazing to me, in a way, that I just recently noticed this shocking difference between what spirituality is to me and the way it is practiced. Of course differences have always been obvious, but I think many of them are a consequence of this more fundamental divergence.
I enjoy reading your posts, and I hope you're doing well.
p.s. Have you ever been in Prague? I'm going this summer, and I'm extremely excited. I'm particularly looking forward to the linguistic challenge! I've never had difficulty communicating in a European country, but as Czech is neither Romantic nor Germanic (I think it might be related to Finnish), I'm anticipating a new trial of my ability to adapt.
I can recognize myself if what you're saying - I don't see why something is a virtue just because someone says it is. If I were to agree with religious ideas of virtue and vice just because they say so and then pursue spirituality because they say I should, the same logic could have caused me to be a neonazi. I don't see how you could learn love through God, I feel like you, that the causal relationship would run the other way. Christians don't have a monopoly on good values, and especially not on love.
Personal anecdotes can be informative, and I enjoy reading them. They are, of course, not a study, but you can get information from them that you couldn't get from a study anyway. I gained a lot of respect for inductive knowledge of the world from doing my Honors thesis. Feel free to share thoughts, even if they're not in direct response to anything I wrote about. It's more like a conversation that way, anyway.
I'm glad you enjoy reading my posts, at least someone does :) Since I don't know how many people read what I write, it's always nice to know that someone gets something out of it.
I've never been to Prague. Sounds like a fun trip! I'd like to see more of Eastern Europe than I have. I've only been to Warsaw to visit family.
Although I am also an atheist, I believe that we can't leave religion out of civil society and politics when a country, any country, has a significant population of people following any religion. "If you bring religion into politics or anywhere else in public life, you are retracing the path that brought disgrace to our history" is not necessarily true, because Religion is a moral standard, and is not good or bad per se. Religions have got us many bad things, but also many good ones. You mention than in Europe Religion is not important, I beg to differ; in Italy, Spain, Poland and some parts of France, Ukraine, and Russia is capital. If you are talking about the Scandinavian countries then you are talking about a –small- part of Europe, not about Europe.
All that you said is applicable to many religions outside of the Christendom and your focus -our focus- in Christianity reveals our own experience. In my country, religion is a source of comfort and values and will remain important for many people for many years. The same way religious people need to respect other people's point of view, we atheist cannot laugh at they beliefs and dismiss them as fairy tales, or trying to adapt them to our particular point of view.
Count me as one of your weekly readers.
Alright, I'll give you the point that my direct experience is limited to a small part of Europe. (Although I wouldn't count Russia as Europe.) However, I've never heard any European politicians speak of God like American ones do. As far as I know, no European country has a motto that references religion or something similar to the mention of God in the American Pledge of Allegiance. That's got to mean something.
In my country, religion is a source of comfort and values and will remain important for many people for many years.
That's interesting, and an experience I haven't seen in others. Although the United States is very religious, I wouldn't say that religion is a source of comfort and values here. It seems to create a lot of hate and division instead. I think how you interpret any given religion has great importance for its effects on a society - what kinds of values does religion provide in your country? How eager to condemn are religious people in your country? Any ideas as to why or why not?
I'm asking because in Sweden, I didn't particularly care if someone was religious in large part because their treatment of me was the same regardless. I felt as comfortable in a group of Christians as in a group of atheists or a group of Muslims or a group of people whose religious preferences I had no clue of. There was a sense of "we" that had nothing to do with religion. Here in the US, on the other hand, I've felt distinctly excluded in groups of Christians, more than in groups of Muslims. Not just excluded, but pushed away.
The same way religious people need to respect other people's point of view, we atheist cannot laugh at they beliefs and dismiss them as fairy tales, or trying to adapt them to our particular point of view.
There is a big difference between thinking that the devil is literally a real entity and seeing past literary imagery to a larger point. I think being a literalist can easily be dismissed as not coherent without dismissing interest in spirituality or religion. I was taught by the Catholic Church in Sweden that the devil doesn't exist, but is only a literary figure representing a larger concept and that hell isn't a place of condemnation, but rather life in the absence of God, something that you control. I can respect that, even though I don't believe in deities. Thinking that there's a red guy with black horns running around making trouble is something completely different.
Even so, I would have a much easier time being respectful of fairy tales as well as more serious religious ideas if I felt more respected in return. A majority of people in this country think that you have to be religious to have good moral values, and it shows. I sometimes feel ridiculed as automatically being a bad person for not believing in some religion. People call my house to convince me I should join their church. That, as mentioned above, tends to create division and hard feelings that are hard to escape if you live here. All religious people aren't the same to deal with, nor are they equally prepared to live in a diverse, open world. Ideas like those that many Americans hold just aren't compatible with modernity. In contrast, the religious people I've met in Europe (yes, yes, still a small sample, but still) can live side by side with people who are not like them and be fine with it. It's a whole lot easier to respect religious people like that. I can really feel that it is completely up to them then.
Why Russia is not Europe? Actually, half of Europe is in Russia, and the lion’s share of the population and cities are in the European part of Russia. Anyways, I agree that in USA the reference to God are just too much. Having to swear on the Bible is just plain wrong.
In Mexico, my country of origin (I live now in Toronto), as well as almost all Latin America, religion is a source of moral values and comfort for a lot of people. You can heard them saying phrases as “First God I will be at home by 6:00” or “Thanks to God I will be off the weekend” or “God Wish that I will get there”. By the way, the last expression is similar to “Inch Allah” in Arabic and even has a more accurate word in Spanish, “Ojala”, and this is not only in the lower economic class but also in the most affluent neighbours.
How eager to condemn are religious people in your country? Depends, but I say that they are still very eager!!!!! But in most case you will see people from different religious backgrounds hanging out; my group was composed of Catholics, Jews, Methodist, and Atheists.
Here in the US, on the other hand, I've felt distinctly excluded in groups of Christians, more than in groups of Muslims. Not just excluded, but pushed away. Possible, I haven’t experience something similar, but again, I tend to befriends people that are not very religious.
And you won’t believe how many people still think that the devil is literally a real entity and seeing past literary imagery to a larger point. Again I think it’s not for us to judge, those are their beliefs, and if you think about it, how it differs from the idea of a deity? It is just the reverse.
Definitively the lack of respect from religious people to other religions and non-religious groups needs a lot of improvement. Some people think they are just better than us because their beliefs and you can see that not only in USA, but in large immigrant groups in Canada and France when religious minorities want to impose their customs to their new home. I think that religious acceptance must go two ways, between different religions and between religious and non-religious people.
And you won’t believe how many people still think that the devil is literally a real entity and seeing past literary imagery to a larger point. Again I think it’s not for us to judge, those are their beliefs, and if you think about it, how it differs from the idea of a deity? It is just the reverse.
Well, I think it's more about the consequences of such beliefs than holding them per se. If you really believe something, you act upon it. For example, I've met people here in the US who essentially do not believe in democracy, because the divine rule of Jesus Christ and/or a theocracy is better. If people could hold beliefs like the devil is a realy physical entity whithout that affecting their political, ethical or economic ideas, that would be fine. However, some religious ideas spur actions that infringe on other's civil and human rights. For example, priests baptized Indian infants and then bashed their heads out in order to ensure that their eternal souls would go to heaven. If you believe what they believed, it's perfectly rational. If you believe witches exist and it is your divine duty to exterminate them, you can wind up a callous murderer. Some ideas are just incompatible with freedom, liberty and respect. It is a difficult problem to say what to do in return, but it's clear to me that we cannot let freedom, openness, civil and human rights be eroded in the name of respect for other's beliefs.
The US Supreme Court just upheld a law banning 2nd trimester abortions. Religious convictions are starting to infringe on my right to my own reproductive decisions. That's not ok, but it's a logical consequence of believing that abortion is murder.
I think that religious acceptance must go two ways, between different religions and between religious and non-religious people.
The problem is, some religious people hold beliefs that basically inure them to acceptance and tolerance. If you believe that you know God's will, and God's will is to subjugate all the infidels, or prevent women from working, or that the only way to Heaven is living life just like you, it is difficult to live in peace with your neighbor. This is a tricky issue, because some religious people can live in peace with others, because they have rejected the dogma of their faiths that stipulate that to be intolerant is to be pious. I've seen it done many times, which is why there is even less of an excuse to blame some old book for your intolerance. But there are also undoubtedly people who cannot stand diversity or tolerance for Others based on their religion.
Should we tolerate intolerance?
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